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XP Mode in Windows 7 is no cop out
I've been waiting to get my hands on the Windows Virtual XP beta for Windows 7 ever since reading about it on Within Windows. If you're not familiar with it, XP Mode is built on Virtual PC and the Remote Desktop Protocol (RDP), and is designed as a way to avoid application incompatibilities like those that plagued Vista.
I've read some interesting complaints about it. Things like "XP Mode is simply a way for Microsoft to trick IT administrators into thinking that upgrading to Windows 7 is a better idea than moving to OS-independent cloud services." Or "It's an admission that Windows XP was just fine and didn't need to be replaced."
Nothing could be further from the truth. Rather, it's an acknowledgment by Microsoft that, even on a new OS, old applications must work flawlessly. It also has tremendous cost-saving potential for small and medium businesses. Businesses much like the one where I work.
At my day job, we (like nearly all of our customers) run point of sale software that has a Windows-only client. Windows XP has run just fine, but we're now getting to the point where it will be time for some hardware upgrades. We only change hardware once every five or six years, so I'd like to install mid-range 64-bit desktops that will be able to handle new applications and peripherals over that span - while still being able to run our trusty old POS software.
I've read some interesting complaints about it. Things like "XP Mode is simply a way for Microsoft to trick IT administrators into thinking that upgrading to Windows 7 is a better idea than moving to OS-independent cloud services." Or "It's an admission that Windows XP was just fine and didn't need to be replaced."
Nothing could be further from the truth. Rather, it's an acknowledgment by Microsoft that, even on a new OS, old applications must work flawlessly. It also has tremendous cost-saving potential for small and medium businesses. Businesses much like the one where I work.
At my day job, we (like nearly all of our customers) run point of sale software that has a Windows-only client. Windows XP has run just fine, but we're now getting to the point where it will be time for some hardware upgrades. We only change hardware once every five or six years, so I'd like to install mid-range 64-bit desktops that will be able to handle new applications and peripherals over that span - while still being able to run our trusty old POS software.
To see if Windows 7 was up to the task, I rolled out an Ultimate x64 desktop this week. Initially, our software failed to run. Once I installed and configured Virtual XP,however, our POS ran seamlessly alongside other applications without so much as a hiccup.
Despite my success, I'm still willing to listen to suggestions. Find me a web-based point of sale system that is designed to handle Canadian tax tables and payroll and can import all seven years of customer, inventory, and labor data that we have packed into a Pervasive SQL database and I'll convince my employers to switch - with one little caveat.
I'll do it as long as you can pull off this switch for less than $1600, because that's about what we'll need to pay to license Windows 7 Pro on all our machines.
That's the budget. For $1,600, all you have to do is supply the labor required to migrate our eight desktops to whichever OS is a better choice and then get us transitioned to new point of sale software that will "free us from Windows." If you can do that as painlessly as I can upgrade our systems to Windows 7 and XP Mode - and for the same amount of money - I'll hire you tomorrow.
If not, maybe it's time to admit that XP Mode isn't such a bad idea after all. It's certainly going to save the small business where I work a lot of money and headaches, and the same will hold true for numerous others like it.
For a better look at XP Mode, check out Rafael Rivera's posts about XP Mode's inner workings and his brief demo that shows how easy it is to publish virtualized applications.
Comments
40
Subscribe to commentsGilbert PalauMay 4th 2009 8:54AM
i don't think he should be considering advice from someone who writes their name as sgdsdsfdsf...
Gilbert PalauMay 4th 2009 8:56AM
could the author dwelve more into what kind of footprint he is dealing with? cuz if this is just 1 computer....
Lee MathewsMay 4th 2009 8:57AM
We've got 8 staff workstations, Gilbert. I estimated $200 per seat for Win7 Pro.
There are an awful lot of 1-2-3 million-dollar-a-year businesses like us, many of them can really benefit from this feature.
Gilbert PalauMay 4th 2009 2:49PM
Could you send me an email, so we can talk more about this? I think I will be able to help you.
JennMay 4th 2009 9:51AM
No luck on a few apps here - I was not able to install Chrystal reports in capability mode.
UCfanMay 4th 2009 10:41AM
If you want to talk about cost-efficient, user-friendly software for your business, you must consider Adaptive Engineering. Adaptive's creative and visually appealing applications understand how important the user experience really is. Adaptive recently expanded to Eastern Europe: http://www.adaptiveengine.com/news
HZMay 4th 2009 11:37AM
Because Windows7 wont have flaws nor viruses, right?
If you want to stay virus-free, go with Linux or Mac.
Now, let's continue with this news post.
WHY ON EARTH did everybody turn the whole comments to "you say windows 7 is bad! and it's good! you deserve to die! get the latest windows dude!" ...
are you freaking kidding me ? this post was about "WHAT'S BETTER" to choose, and you have to analize the real thing, not "how good it actually is for something you'll never take advantage of"...
if i would choose a solution thinking about how windows 7 is improved and not how does those improvements affect me...then i would deffinately go and buy a bunch of INTEL's i7 systems for all the employees. Just because "don't you know how much power you are loosing? and your current hardware is über old dude! it's time to upgrade or die!"
if you do this...then let me tell you, you are wasting your money :)
i don't get it why you people turn the comments around to make them look like "viva Mac and viva Linux, screw Windows!", when in fact, it's the total opposite.
DachMay 4th 2009 1:05PM
Actually, this makes good sense. I've done support for several companies years ago that had upgraded all their systems to XP, but had to keep one or two machines around that still ran Win98 (or even Win95 in the case of one company) because they had one arcane piece of software that was critical to some aspect of company operation, but would never be updated for several reasons.
This means that people can upgrade all the computers in their network to 7, and not to have to keep one XP machine around for one piece of software.
Gilbert PalauMay 4th 2009 3:58PM
I think the built in virtualization feature in Windows 7, is a good thing, but like with everything Microsoft there is a catch... Having the optimized chipset in your computer is going to give yo ugreat results, but if you dont have a new PC it will actually make you go into the cost of buying a CPU that supports this.
Otherwise you are going to have a lousy performance. Whereas with Linux or Mac you can go by doing a bootcamp in mac or using crossover in Linux, and linux still gives you the headache to buy crossover which is going to be another expense.
The same way Apple has bootcamp, it would be a great idea for Linux to have something similar, easier done than doing a dual boot.
As for Windows 7, I think MS should have created a solution that worked well without any virtualization chipset, and then limit the performance enhancement for games for example using a cpu with virtualization chipset built in.
Windows 7 is in my opinion what windows vista should have been. Vista felt like Windows Me more than a new competitive and innovative piece of software, it was an incomplete and problematic OS.
Lee MathewsMay 4th 2009 4:05PM
Perhaps you're misunderstanding what I'm looking at. We'll be selling our old hardware - XP licenses and all - and replacing it. The new hardware WILL support hardware virtualization and we'll have at least 2GB ram (ram is dirt cheap).
If we bootcamp or virtualize with Mac or Linux, we'll still have to pony up for XP licenses to stay legal. If we go with Windows 7 Pro +, the XP license is included.
Performance is great. Impact on the rest of the system is pretty much nil.
HZMay 4th 2009 4:30PM
if you already decided to sell your hardware with the software in it...
then why on earth are you asking if it's good or not to buy it with windows 7...
OF COURSE it's a good choice...
if you were going to keep everything and just upgrade the operating system (at least, this is what I understood from the news post), then windows 7 WOULDN'T BE the best choice...
a Mac/Linux alternative would be the best choice...
but, given the fact that you are already going to change everything and not keeping XP licenses...then just go and buy w7, there's no questioning on that :S ...
Lee MathewsMay 4th 2009 4:31PM
How would Mac/Linux be "the best choice?" Our POS software won't run on Linux. Period.
Moving away from Windows would mean transition costs and downtime while we move to another POS platform.
Gilbert PalauMay 4th 2009 4:52PM
Well if you moved to mac, you dont sell your xp licenses... you keep them. Use them on the bootcamp partition.
You asked for a Web POS system, I mentioned you 2 of them, Lightspeed and phppos something...
As for transition costs, and downtime I dont think there would be any. You can prepare tha macs with bootcamp or parallels on the side and then do a switchover during the weekend or a time the shop is not open or not too busy.
It just seems like you want to believe that Windows 7 is this ray of light opening from the skies and showing to be your salvation... and frankly if you are planning to move a multimillion dollar company to an OS that has not been tested or proven as a business platform, I'd say you are either the bravest SysAdmin, or the stupidest (no offense intended) :) I understand that you see the benefits of buying new hardware to run windows 7 (I don't understand how you are buying 8 machines, with the capacity to run Windows 7 + the cost of the license, which is not going to be $200... I mean just by that alone you are basically poning up $1600 to buy Windows7 for 8 computers, where you could buy 8 mac mini's, save on the XP license because you already have one, and pony up for something else.
Lee MathewsMay 4th 2009 5:05PM
(note: there was another comment, deleted due to language...sorry guy, no expletives)
Taking licenses from the old machines isn't an option - they must be sold complete, with the original license.
And the new hardware isn't being purchased "just to run Windows 7." It will, though, because that's going to be the best option for our needs.
I'm not being brave, I'm testing this now, just like other RC users. And I'm pleased so far.
As for being a "fanboy," if anything, I'm a fan of things that make my job easier. In this case, that's VXP.
HZMay 4th 2009 5:26PM
i wrote a huge explanation on the Linux solution and how you just wrote a post about "how much you like windows", and just for a "freaking", it gets deleted, awesome.
good luck spending thousands without any reason to.
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w7 is a good OS, or at least that's what its showing us, but not the best choice when you want to save money and get better performance with what you already have and on top of this, you want Options.
HZMay 4th 2009 5:28PM
or maybe it wasn't deleted and your last comment dissapeared? ok wth?
Gilbert PalauMay 4th 2009 5:32PM
Wait a second, the word S_____D is an Expletive? Seriously? My bad. lets change that to, "not too intelligent thing to do" is that better? Its what I meant anyways.
Well It seems you want to go the windows 7 way, so go ahead and do it, then let us know how well it went. If it works for ya then awesome, we can then take it seriously. If it doesnt, insert somewhere the "We told you so" somewhere... lol
HZMay 5th 2009 6:29AM
here you have the exact same post without the "curses" (if you say they were...because they were mere expressions.)
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"How would Mac/Linux be "the best choice?" Our POS software won't run on Linux. Period."
you can emulate most of the windows software just fine with Wine on Linux and you have Crossover too, which costs...how much ? 20 bucks ?
and you can use virtualization software like virtualbox or vmware (which are totally free and silly easy to use) to install XP on your old pc which now has Linux on it and guess what, you stay legal because you would be using the same license for each PC. Oh and I forgot to say that you also get way better performance using the horse power of all the pcs together.
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"Moving away from Windows would mean transition costs and downtime while we move to another POS platform."
really? so much of a transition cost over THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS by selling old hw and buying new hardware and OSs ? and you would still have a downtime while you do this transition to W7.
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if you are just going to say "windows is best. Period." then don't waste a news post just to say how much of a good windows fanboy you are. or at least, make the post about "how good you think XP Mode is" and not "is it really worth it ? what do you think guys ?" and then when we give you Facts, you go and say "no, W7 is better. Period."
we are giving you GOOD points on why mac/linux would be cheaper/better, but instead of thinking about it and Admitting that we are damn right (Period.), you go and say "oh sorry, forgot to mention i only want windows, and i want it because i say it's the best OS/system to work with. Period."
plain silly to ask for help when you don't actually want it nor wont accept it.
IMO.
JustinMay 9th 2009 11:29PM
Lee,
Nice find on the windows 7 - XP virtualization. This makes switching to windows 7 a lot less scary! Good move by MS, instead of making the whole OS backwards compatible (and all the problems that come with that) make a virtual environment for older applications.
You might want to check out our web based POS system: http://www.merchantos.com/
Don't know if it meets your specific needs but it's a great alternative for a lot of businesses.
MannyAug 1st 2009 12:05AM
I have to agree with HZ, Linux (free!!!) + Crossover/Wine ftw! And since its Linux and their are many current and mainstream distros like Ubuntu or opensuse, or lightweight ones that run amazingly on old hardware, you win both times. No money needed for new computers or any OS licensing costs (Linux is free, sorry another reminder :)), just the $40 or $70 for Crossover Linux at http://www.codeweavers.com/products/cxlinux/.